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#1060570 - 01/30/19 05:56 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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New motors should arrive Weds, tomorrow, door bottoms are primed, pinch weld seam seals touched up, and ready for top coat. Added a little more RTV to the bridges, happy with them now. Hopefully with new door/roof seals and the RTV the rattle will be gone.

As far as window motor install the Helm's says window must be up, clamp window in place, remove motor. The window regulator sprocket is at the bottom when the window is up making motor removal through the access hole difficult. Haven't found a good, accurate video of a G body window motor replacement. Will try the window down method first. The motor doesn't care about what orientation the regulator is in.

Found this old post on the TurboBuick.com, found it interesting. Noted in that post is the body ground for the window circuit, it appears it's inside the driver's door. Mentioned it's possible as the door hinge bushing become junk the ground path for the window circuit could be compromised. Will have to check that. After the new pass motor is installed will see what happens when a temporary ground direct to the battery and driver's door effects speed.

The focus of the Buick post is how the the internal circuit breaker in the window motor can cause a motor to run slow, and how to bypass the breaker.
https://turbobuick.com/threads/a-free-trick-to-help-speed-up-your-power-windows.256820/

Recently install a Delco replacement motor in my 95 Astro, window speed increase significantly. Bought the same motors, different # number, for the SS. Hoping to notice a difference just from motor install.
Bob

#1060591 - 02/02/19 03:51 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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WWWWAAAAAYYYY to cold the past several days to spend time in the shop, especially to spot in some lacquer. So cold in there that the packing on the water shutoff valve seeped and had a iceberg attached to it today. There is heat tape and pipe insulation that wraps the supply, the pipe never froze in the past 20 years. first time for the that iceberg. Supposed to be warm next week, replacing that 1" ball valve is at the top of the list now.
Bob

#1060667 - 02/07/19 05:27 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Replaced the water shutoff valve last Sat, it was a warm day, like 32 degrees. As expected the long term memory is not good, it was a 3/4" valve, not 1". Done for a while now.

Installed the new Delco window motor. Once you drill out access to the three mounting bolts it's an easy removal with the window rolled all the way down against it's down travel stop. Helms manual say clamp window in the full up position to remove, no need to do that. Also Helms say use 3/4" hole saw in dimples to get to the bolts, two dimples were off bolt centers and couldn't get socket on bolt heads, had to "move" holes rearward a little with a grinder to get the 13mm socket on them. New bracket that came with the new motor doesn't have tapped holes for bolts, tapped them to 5/16" before install that bracket to the new motor. Old bolts had no indication whether they were US or metric on their head and they are only 1/2" long and couldn't use pitch gauge to determine thread. Would have thought they would be metric, 8-1.25, but think that's was another short cut GM did in the metric conversion of the G-body, left the window motor bolts the same thread the earlier US bolt cars used. Go figure.

Being the car has sat in the frigid cold shop for weeks now the battery was charged for a couple days to insure full 12 volts. Once the new motor was installed, cleaned the wire connector before install, lubed the tracks for the rollers with lithium, the two regulator pivot points lubed with 80 wt oil, sprocket/motor gear with lithium and worked the window up and down several times. Those lube points were all done a few years ago when the beltline trim was replaced and were in very good condition then, and now.
The results netted from installing the new motor is noticeable, window does go up and down faster on just 12 volts battery voltage, they will be even faster with the engine running, and now acceptable. Worth the 40 bucks for the motor. When i replaced the driver window motor in my Astro last Summer the old motor was disassembled to look at the commutator and brushes. You can see why the motor slows over time, wear and oil on the segments. Also the contact points on the internal thermal take a beating as noted in that Turbobuick link.

Now I can list window motors as speed parts, 40 bucks for a +50% increase in speed. Wish cheap engine parts got those results.

Two coats of POR15 done to the door inside at the pinch weld, maybe 1" to 2" up each side of that valley. POR doesn't stick to the Rusty Jones rustproofing that was dealer install when this car was new. It was sprayed in the lower 4 to 5" of the door and helped preserve the bottom of the door. Thanks for that, but removing that rustproofing is a mess, been there, done that, naphtha. End result was Rusty stayed on above the POR paint line, and the POR will protect the door bottom now. Done, check inside bottom door off the list.

Next is paint the black lacquer on the door's jamb areas, Will spray from the door latch down, entire bottom edge and up the front edge to the lower hinge. You will see none off this with the door closed so blending old with new won't be an issue. As I mentioned earlier Duplicolor doesn't make the specific black paint code anymore, now a universal gloss black lacquer. Duplicolor now makes a code specific Enamel spray for cars, guess sacrificing the lacquer codes allow this to happen. Only time will tell if the universal black lacquer is a good match to the 33 year old 19U paint.

Should note that two light coats Duplicolor Self Eching lacquer primer was sprayed first after all the door areas repaired were cleaned up. It drys hard and fast, a good product. Then two coats of Duplicolor Sandable primer later, 600 dry sanded to feather into the old black lacquer, just needs masked and sprayed now. If, when, I strip the roof and A/B pillar paint off the car I may consider using that Self Etch primer. Lacquer primers are funny things, gotta be careful about mixing three different lacquers layers together. Lacquer primers are hard to find these days. One reason I use the Duplicolor lacquers.

About sanding the lacquer primer. was told by a painter friend not to wet sand lacquer primer, it absorbs water. Never to old to learn something.
Bob

#1060689 - 02/09/19 05:26 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Another nice day weather wise today. Despite the cold day managed to pre-heat the door to 65 degrees and spray 4 coats and spot in the body jamb. Ended up painting the entire latch side of the door, the color match actually is very good. In a month or so will buff it out and knock some of the gloss off the new paint. Can't have it looking to good. Will let it gas out for a week or more before starting the new seals.

Finally, funny how a new door and roof seal project get so involved.
Bob

#1060746 - 02/14/19 02:58 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Did a test fit on the Fairchild door seal on the right side door today. The latch side seems to align pretty good but the front top of the seal is crap. Can't see how it's possible to install the top without trimming a lot and it would still be unacceptable. And the first pin down from there is off be a lot, maybe 3/4". Soooooo. That seal will find a home in a trash bag.
Made a phone call to Mike this afternoon, we talked about what is available and his own door seal he now sells. Ordered both door and another set of roof seals from him, they already have been shipped. Gotta love Mike.
I'm expecting the fit to be right this time, need to move on to the driver's door.

Have been shopping for a gallon of black lacquer for a while now. The roof, trunk lid and spoiler need to get repainted yet this Winter. Will be happy if the roof and pillars get done, again a preservation thing, not trophies. Called Hibernia Rest who still sell nitro-cellulose for the real old cars but no longer sells the quality acrylic lacquer. Hibernia I thought from previous inquires was my home run, but, stuck out. Duplicolor Paint Shop paints are lacquer but they require a clear. Just want to shoot 6 or 8 coats of black lacquer and be done, other than the tedious job of color sanding and buffing. Being I'm blending new paint into the old paint for now the clear will make that much more difficult.
Will stop at a few body shops i know and see if anyone has a gallon stuffed away in a back room out of eyesight. I got a 1/2 gal a few years ago that way, enough to do the hood. Spraying lacquer on a car is a no-no for body shops now, but anybody can spray lacquer at their house, except in CA. Supposedly it's illegal to even ship lacquer to CA.
The Restoration Shop sells lacquer which they say is single stage but recommend clearing it. Price is cheap for a gallon of black and a gallon of thinner, $156+ ship and tax. When the paint makers stopped making lacquers 400 bucks was a common price for the few remaining gallons, that was several years ago. You just have to wonder how good the Restoration Shop paint is, almost to cheap.
Most likely will spend the money and get a gallon of their black and do some test panels. Nothing to lose but a few bucks.

Bob

#1060864 - 02/22/19 03:27 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Hey Bob, good luck with the new seals, let us know how they work out.


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#1060866 - 02/22/19 06:22 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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It's been a week since the last update, progress didn't stop.

The door/roof seal availability of something I'm happy with halted the final assemble of the pass door. Now have two sets of door seals and two sets of roof seals sitting, identical sets from different venders. Unfortunately both door seals are not made correctly, 3/4" to short on the front, top of the door. Both sets of roof seals appear to be identical, Fairchild and Softseal the venders. Quality is good, just think the rubber is to firm, especially on the upright section. Have ordered Metro roof seals to compare to Softseal, will use the ones I like better. They should arrive Sat.
Thanks to Mikes Monte and I now have a GM pass side door seal which makes me very happy, So the pass door can be finished with the GM door seal and whichever roof seal is better.
The driver's door is another story for seals. The roof seal will be the same as the pass side but don't have a clue which vender's door seal i will use. As of now I have 7 door or roof seals for the doors and will buy at least one if not two more door sets until something suits me. Boy I wish i could just find a left GM door seal!!!!!!!!

At least this "new weather stripping question" post is still mostly about that.

The real progress is that the pass door slowed me down, no seals yet to install but done otherwise. So moved on to the left door, changed the window motor, lubed everything, PORed the inside lower seam, removed the lower hinge pin and installed a temp pin, re-glued the door guard beam to the door skin, started the repaint of the door rust spots. The left door only has one small rust area around the drain hole at the back of the door and the rub mark where the seat belt lock lever hits. Compared to the amount of repair the right door needed the left is a cake walk. YEA! The door seal on the left door will stay on until I find a quality new seal.

Next is pull the left door off and into the door stand to replace the top hinge, replace bushings and pin in the lower, repair surface rust on the body A pillar and paint, new seam sealer where needed, and run a ground wire from the door to the chassis to insure full voltage to the window motors. The ground for the window motors is now attached to the door shell, then through the hinges to body to complete ground. We can do better.

Slow progress, but progress.
Bob

#1060870 - 02/22/19 05:16 PM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Made a few phone calls this morning, Steele Rubber door seal is a Metro seal. Precision Replacement Parts door seal is not made by them, they would only say Made In USA.
Trim Parts now owns Softseal. So three door seal producers, Fairchild which I know is made wrong, Metro and Softseal. Having talked to Mike a few times he told me this is what I'd find out. Thanks Mike.
For S&G a call was made to my local Chevy dealer parts guy who has dug up discontinued parts for me several times. No luck with his search

Will see if I'm happy with the Metro roof seals and make a decision on whether to go Metro or Softseal for the left door seal.
Bob

#1060872 - 02/23/19 02:09 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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#1060949 - 03/01/19 06:24 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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A little more progress.
Driver's door old door seal carefully removed down the latch side and 1/3 of the way across the bottom. Entire latch side of the door and most of the door bottom edge now in 5 coats of black lacquer after repairing minor surface rust issues. A lot less repairs on this door than the right door was. YEA.

Next driver's door removed and resting in the cradle that was made for the right door. Learned from the right door how to setup the cradle for easy reinstall. Top hinge will be replaced so unbolted that hinge at the door, pulled the temp lower hinge pins and slid the door free and clear of the A pillar. Didn't disconnect any wires for the locks or window. The boot for the wires was pulled out of the door and body holes allowing the door to be moved almost perpendicular to the body. Plenty on room to refinish the A pillar down to the sill plate. Removed the roof seal's first 3" at the bottom of the A pillar which allow fixing some surface rust and repaint of the area the adhesive will touch.

With the door out of the way, the wire boot now open, could feed a ground wire from the factory ground point at the left bottom of the dash to the window circuit ground on the left door. The kick panel trim had to be removed along with the sill plate to paint the lower section of the A pillar anyway. Adding that ground only insures the window circuit ground is good, not depending on going though the hinges and door latch as the ground path. It took longer to select the what black wire used as the ground than doing that wire install. Will it speed up the window motors, maybe, maybe not, can't hurt.

Lots of body seams and old seam sealer in the top hinge area of the body. Three layers of sheetmetal at one place. Many years ago saw some seam sealer had dried and fallen out in that area. A quick fix then was to reseal with black silicone RTV. Removing it along with all the original seam sealer at the primary body seam was a chore. Where there was surface rust I didn't properly clean before the RTV, it bridged the rust and didn't stick well, and stuck like crazy to the black lacquer. RTV seemed like a quick fix back then, hindsight now, don't use RTV.

Many washes of the rust spots with first naval jelly, then vinegar and finally with a weak Muriatic acid. along with scratching and wire bushing got those areas ready for some self etching primer on the bare metal. Spend many hours on that primary seam until satisfied it was shiny metal. There was pitting but metal was still solid, no perfs and rust started from the outside of the seam. Original thought water was getting into the A pillar and causing the damage at that seam. Had a new windshield install last year and while out got to inspect the A pillar, cherry, no leaking there.
Three light coated of sandable primer over the self etch primer Wed night and I could walk away and go to bed.
Thurs afternoon scuffed the primer, a final wash with some prep,,re-masked the jam to shoot black, applied SEM black seam sealer to the areas that needed it and waited a 1/2 hour for the seam sealer to take a set. 4 or 5 coats of Duplicolor emptied another can. Waited a 20 minutes and pulled all the masking. DONE!!
I knew that whole section of the bodies hinge area was going to be work, knew that when I put RTV on it years ago. Pulling the door away from the body now allowed access to the body area to do a good job. To bad it's one of those areas nobody ever sees, it's pretty now. But, DONE.

As with the other side the car was raised and blocked at the left #2 body bushing so the ride height doesn't change as the door is removed and reinstalled. The top hinge bolts will be snugged to the body, door slide right back into place, lower hinge pin dropped in, door side hinge bolts installed and snugged. Because the lower hinge hasn't been removed it won't be hard to adjust the door alignment. All 6 of the top hinge bolts are easily accessible. Just hoping the new aftermarket top hinge doesn't cause any problems. Metro roof seals showed up Tues, not a lot of time to compare to the two sets of soft seal laying on the trunk. But looking at the Metro first though were the Softseal looked better in several places and the Metro may be softer. More on that later once test fitting of them gets done.

Last Winter at this time was laying under the car for a long time moving the lower ball joint forward 11/16" to gain Caster. Not sure which of the two projects, doors or caster was more of a PITA.

Oil man was at the shop last Fri, 635 bucks to fill the tank, glad it hasn't been cold. Spot painting requires 65-70 degrees in the painting zone. The two halogen quartz lamps are a big help.

Oh, think i found the rattle in the left door that drives me nuts some times. The plunger in the left door lock solenoid rattles. Will find a fix for that without buying a new one.
Bob

#1060965 - 03/03/19 05:48 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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I would suggest using 2 part epoxy primer as it is waterproof instead of self etching primer which is highly porous and holds moisture like a sponge. Even if you don't have a paint gun, you can use a Preval sprayer for touch up jobs. I also suggest using 2 part epoxy seam seamer and coat it with more epoxy primer.


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#1060968 - 03/04/19 01:47 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Have used a Prevail many times, love them. But it doesn't work when held in the horizontal plane, just the vertical. In a confined area I was working in you need all kinds of different spray angles to get paint on the jamb and doors.

Spray epoxy primer may be better but the little bit of bare metal to prime wasn't that much. Epoxy may be the better choice even for lacquer but all the areas fixed are out of site with the door closed. Have given thought to using Epoxy on the roof when I strip the paint off it.
The Duplicolor Self etch is a lacquer, dries fast and hard and would be totally compatible with their sandable primer and top coat. Being I'm basically in the preservation mode and not the pretty mode the lacquers worked very well.
The new Duplicolor spray nozzles are pretty cool. You can rotate the tip of the nozzle to change the pattern from vertical or horz and anywhere in between. First time I've seen any nozzle with the capability. All the Duplicolor paints i bought have that tip. Makes it easy to spray some difficult areas in the jamb.
Bob

#1060969 - 03/04/19 05:56 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Got the driver's door reinstalled and top hinge adjusted to my liking. The method of removing and reinstalling with the cradle worked great, a one man show. Being the bottom hinge wasn't moved and used as the locator for the new top hinge it was almost a plug and play. Door side of that hinge was snugged and body side was moved for and aft to adj gap/body lines. As with most things you think you can make it a little better but wind up where you were an hour earlier. But door position is exactly where it was prior to removal and DONE. Neither door had any sag when I started, both now have zero.

After learning a lesson on the pass door trying to drive the hinge pins in to fully seat the fluting under the head of the pin changed things up on the driver's door. On the pass door hinge pins I realized quickly you will never be able to seat them completely when the hinge is installed, to much flex of the hinge, can't hit them squarely on their heads and almost impossible to get the punch cleanly on the head. So on the pass side drove them in 1/2 way and welded the pin to the hinge. A viable fix.
Got smarter on the other door. Only had to put a pin in the lower hinge on the driver's side, new hinge went on the top. Miked the body of the new pin, .349", fluting is .370" and is .200" long. Old pins fluting was .365", and only .175" long. So fluting is oversize from stock, part of the reason the new pins are more difficult to drive.
Chucked the new pin in the drill press and used a disc grinder to remove the fluting off the pin, took it down to .352". Pins are hardened steel, grinding is the only way to remove the fluting. It only required a couple love taps to drive it home until the head of the pin is down against the hinge. A couple good tacks with the MIG, some paint and no one will ever know. Another lesson learned.

Finished the new ground wire to the driver's door. With a new motor, better ground, all the moving parts well lubed again the window speed on the driver's door is more than acceptable with the engine running, it's quick, just not fast like the new cars but I'm happy. Couldn't check the pass window, no switch on that side yet. But it was the slow window before and know even at just battery voltage it's much quicker now. Win Win.

Before the 5-9" of snow arrives tonight got the car out of the shop and turned around to move back onto the pass door, more room on one side of the bay. Both doors are ready to do the door and roof seals, only a few very minor details on the doors yet. Now have an NOS GM door seal for pass door, it goes on first. Then figure out whether Metro of Softseal for the roof. Currently have two roof sets of Softseal and one Metro roof set. I can install either set dry first and see quickly which one I don't like and which I may need to be happy with.

A original door and roof seals are still install on the driver's door. Partly removed at places to repair/paint but reinstalled nicely now, Next week will buy Metro or Softseal door seals, probable both, and hopefully be satisfied with one or the other. Finally getting around to replacing door and roof seals which is what the BIG questions is, what is the best seal choices when choices are so limited.

This whole project started for me because of the left roof rail seal was damaged by some knucklehead. He put his shoulder to the A pillar to move the car forward in the shop. 25 years of doing that takes it toll. Spend a bunch of bucks and a month of time on this fix. Another week or so should finish.
Bob

#1060974 - 03/04/19 05:43 PM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Not sure how I missed all of this but I feel pretty caught up now...Good work Bob, as usual.

I remember the fight to remove the passenger side window seal about 6 years ago on my car and and the new driver side seal is still in the box. Screw that mess, I'll put up with the wind noise or turn up the stereo... laugh


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060987 - 03/05/19 04:09 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Yeah, removing all that roof seal adhesive is a time consuming job, and makes a mess of the interior. The pass roof seal area is all cleaned up and ready for the new seal. Still have the original seal on the driver's side to remove yet when I get back to that side this week.
Bob

#1060992 - 03/05/19 05:47 PM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Bob - What do you recommend to use to remove the old adhesive/glue without damaging the paint underneath?

I drove out to visit Mike Kramer at Mikes Montes last week and bought (among a number of other things) GM seals for where the T-Tops overlap the windows.
Reasonable price and he has a number left from when he bought the remaining world's supply. Gotta love that guy.
Replacing the aftermarket ones which have variable wall thickness, some hard lumps inside, angled cuts in the face and orange peel surfaces.
Didn't know he had the original GM ones at the time.

Keep posting!

Gordon

#1061037 - 03/08/19 03:42 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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The adhesive GM used is very hard to remove. Recommended remover is 3M adhesive remover which I didn't use. Was concerned with getting it on the lacquer paint. The local body supply said to use wax and grease remover, as in a paint prep wash. It helped a little as it would stay wet and soak the adhesive a little but in the end it was pick and pull, and rub. Cleaning every last bit of old adhesive out of the roof seal track took a long time to just do the pass side. Driver's side is up next.

Another update. A trial fitting of first the Metro roof seal and then the Softseal on the pass door and the Softseal won. The Metro is a tad softer but I didn't care for the end sections of the seal, small and not original appearing. Softseal ends closer to factory seals. Metro seal had a moulded section at the bend at the top of the A pillar, looked odd and had a hard time tucking under the blowout clip. The Softseal is a continuous piece from the bottom of the A to the top corner at the B. It conformed to that corner of the A nicely and looks original. Liked the Softseal 90 degree moulded section at the top of the B pillar more than the Metro, a cleaner bonding of the straight sections. So Softseal it is for the roof rail seals.

Started on the 90 degree corner and worked out from there, The rail seal track was totally cleaned of old adhesive and the section down the B pillar took a while to get the seal into the grooves of the track.Once in the track pinned the bottom of the seal and then pulled the seal partly out to move it up or down to distribute the seal evenly in the track. Across the roof's track and down to the bottom of the A was an easy install and the weatherstripping fit nicely. The end seal section at the bottom of the A was temporarily pinned and the seal need to be pulled back out of the track to distribute the seal evenly. Once happy with getting the 90 degree corner located properly and the seal "stretched" correctly the ends were glued/pinned with 3M black Adhesive.
GM glued the roof seal it's entire length with two rows of adhesive. Knowing that these Softseal roof seals may not last to long, knowing what a PITA the adhesive removal is, know my car sees little rain, knowing I have another full set of Softseal roof seals laying on the bench as back up, the decision was made not to glue them in the entire length, just the ends.

Before the new GM door seal is installed the door was closed to check the window to the installed roof seal fit. The window had to be moved rearward to properly seat the front A pillar section, The two UP stops adjusted for the window to be a little lower in the roof section and parallel to the seal when up. The window adjusted to tilt inward a hair more to increase contact at the roof length. All these adjustments are easily done using the provided bolts. From appearance and opening and closing the door the interaction between the window and seal is spot on now.
Next is install the GM door seal. Per GM 3M adhesive used from the top of the front seal section down to the bottom of the door. On the latch side adhesive is about 1 foot down from the top. Both the ends of the door seal got the 3M on the door and seal, allowed to tack and then installed and screwed in place. VERY happy with the ends of those GM seals, fit perfectly and have the plastic in the end to prevent tearing.

Now time to close the door with both new seals installed. As expected you need to close the door hard to compress the new seals. Contact on the window seals was checked via the paper test in about 10 places. PASS.
Closed the door for the day and went home hoping after sitting 12 hours the door would close a little easier. Today put the rest of the door panels back together, so it a completely done door now. It's still to hard to close for my liking presently but will let it closed for days to see if the seal take a set. Will go back and see if the ends of the roof seals need a touch more adhesive yet. Once happy with adhesion apply a seal lube to both seals which should soften them a little.
At the end of the day today tried to move the latch pin out a little but bolt wouldn't budge. Removed the vent cover in the jamb and sprayed CRC Freeze Off on the bolt's threads out the back of the mount. That stuff works great, will attempt a loosening tomorrow.

Turned the car around in the bay to start the final install of the driver's door. Removed the door lock solenoid in hopes of fixing a rattle there. I rarely use the door lock on that side. If the rattle can't be eliminated the lock solenoid may be eliminated.
Funny thing, solenoid on driver's door was riveted on, pass door solenoid is bolted on, hmmmm. I've owned the car since 9200 miles, it wasn't me who replace the pass solenoid. Did it come from the factory that way?

Metro door seals from Rock will be here tomorrow. Metro seems to be the peoples choice for door seals over Softseal, time will tell. If not happy will buy Softseal and install the better of the two on the driver's door. Already have bought three sets of roof seals (2 Softseal and one Metro), two sets of Fairchild door seals (will be trashed), a pass GM door seal and the Metro door set tomorrow. That's 13 seals to replace 4. Buying the Softseal door seals would make 15 seals.

Got an email this morning from Paul B here on the forum, he had a lead on a pair of GM NOS door seals for me. It didn't pan out, they were sold in short order. Still wish I could find an NOS driver's door seal to compliment the pass NOS door seal.

With any luck it's possible the driver's door will be done this weekend and bleeding seal money will stop. Anxious to get the car out and step on the gas pedal for the thrill. Also to get out at 60-70 mph and see how many whistles there are.
Bob

#1061047 - 03/09/19 02:13 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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When I replaced my door seals with GM ones, it doors remained hard to close for awhile, probably 6 months before the seal took a set, just an FYI!


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#1061061 - 03/10/19 06:03 PM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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mmc427ss Online content
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When I think about how much time I've spent just doing some R&R on the doors and replacing seals and then compare it to the enormous amount of time several others have spent replacing floors, quarters, rotisserie the body, WOW, they are dedicated people. For a month now have been playing with this little Winter project. And I'm tired of it! This week coming is supposed to be pretty nice, need to get the car out for a drive to appreciate the hours of frustration to make the doors nice again.

Couple things.
Finally managed to get the pass door strike bolt loose. Freeze Off did the trick, just took a day for it to work, Temporarily moved the strike out a little so the door latch didn't "pop" when you opened the door. Will lube the seals later this week which should soften them a little. Readjust strike in a few weeks. Very happy with the glass to seal adjustment on the pass side, could almost say it's perfect.

Drilled the rivets out of the driver's door power lock solenoid, removed it from the door, removed the mounting bracket from the solenoid, tack welded nuts to the bracket so it could be bolted back on instead of rivets. The rubber boot on the solenoid was tore at the bottom, trimmed boot to reattach to the solenoid, cut a piece of 3/4" thick foam and installed it inside the bottom of the boot to prevent the solenoid shaft from rattling. Reinstalled the solenoid, hopefully won't have to listen to it rattling anymore.

Have three roof seal for the driver's side, 2 Softseal, 1 Metro which I don't like, picked the best of the Softsel to install. Cleaned the casting flashing off the areas to be sealed, just the end pieces, scuffed with emery and washed with alcohol . After spending several hours cleaning the old seal and all traces of adhesive out of the track replaced the seal track on the B pillar. One of several production defects in the car since new was the the chrome track used instead of the black trim piece. Part of this seal project was to swap that part out with the donor that Steve R. sent me 10 years ago. GM used a rubbery strip seal with adhesive on both side to seal that seal track piece to the larger black "gutter" trim piece on the car. Looked for a replacement type strip seal but ended up using a bead of black RTV to reseal it. You can't see it and that will work fine for as long as I need it to.

Installed the roof seal and made sure the A pillar corner was not being pulled by the straight sections. That corner need to be relaxed. Had trouble getting the B pillar area of the seal to seat fully in the new trim piece installed, the Softseal is pretty fat in the edge. Finally siliconed that edge of the seal to aid in the install.
Temporarily install only one pin in the ends to hold them in place while spreading the straight runners of seal to be relaxed. That took some time but happy with the seal fit.

With the old door seal install yet closed the door, glass to new roof seal fit is lousy. Played with adjustments many times till "that's as good as it will get". Not happy with the 90 degree B corner, the Sofseal seal up the B pillar is very firm and holds the glass top edge away a hair. The pass side is very good in that corner, the driver's side will have to be OK. Had to move the glass rearward a little, front up stop had to go down a lot. back up stop down about 1/2 of the front, and the glass top tilted inward a good bit too. Glass seals very good on the A pillar, B pillar, is level all the way across the top and is only a hair loose in that 90 degree. Hopefully not a whistle there and doesn't leak, time will tell.

Today now happy with the roof seal positioning and fit glued the seal ends and pinned both ends of the seal. They look good, hopefully a good bond with the 3M adhesive.

When the MIG was out for the solenoid fix put a tack weld on the driver's door hinge pin. Just need to do a paint touchup, done.

Removed the old driver's door seal, it had a lot of adhesive on the hinge side, from the glass area to the bottom corner. Most of it peeled off with some effort but from the looks of it will require a paint touchup before the new seal goes on. More work.

Looking at my paint job on the latch side of the door, will sand and throw a few more coats on it. When it was very cold in the shop I used the quartz lamp to heat the sheetmetal, got it to hot and lacquer flashed off to quickly and paint didn't lay well. Pyrometer told me that surface was to hot. Live and learn.

Hopefully get the Metro door seal test fitted on Mon, would need to order Softseal door seal Mon night if not happy with the Metro.

Oh, window speed on both windows is very acceptable when the engine is running, pass side is much quicker with the new motor.

Asked about what removes the factory adhesive from the roof seal track. Tried the wash prep, mineral spirits, alcohol, lacquer thinner, didn't have acetone on hand. Lacquer thinner worked best but left a gooey mess and evaporated quickly. Could have tried Goo Gone, graffiti remover, nail polish remover, carb cleaner, all possible harmful to the body paint.

Don't know who's reading all this verbiage posted but hoping the details don't bore ya but help make seals a little less frustrating if you ever need to replace them.
Bob

#1061064 - 03/10/19 07:59 PM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
Joined: Jul 2000
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Jersey Shore
Wow Bob. After reading that my door seals can rot to hell if they want. Never gonna change them.


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#1061065 - 03/10/19 08:32 PM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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AkronAero Online content
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Akron OH
Actually Bob, we are reading and learning from you, and appreciate that you give it so much more care than the body shop ever would. We are all wondering if you would like to contract out your services?
I went to MikesMontes and picked up two genuine GM t-top panel seals (where they rest on the glass) to replace my aftermarket ones last weekend. Wish we had done this from the beginning but didn't know he had them and didn't think to ask. Humble guy and very wise!
Look similar but handle better going in. I see I will have to spend time as you are on adjusting them for a tight seal.
Thanks and keep posting.
Oh, and how much will you charge in the future???
Gordon

#1061070 - 03/11/19 01:26 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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mmc427ss Online content
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Gordon, thanks for the acknowledgement. Since the death of the "information highway", now the advertising highway, you have to wonder if the time you spend hammering on a keyboard is time well spent.That sharing of information via forums, mailing lists, even Wikipedia, has faded away and is now stuck in everyone's cell phone memory as social media, never to be saved for other to use. Gone. For me, stuck in yesterday, I'll continue long, sometime hard to follow paragraphs of this is what I've found out.
If you look at all the forums, Protouring, LateralG, LS1, the turbo Buicks, Camaro, Chevelle, Nova, the list is endless, even here, there is barely a pulse anymore. The NMCOA will pass away in June, The Nova Nationals is merged with Chevrolet Carslisle in July, my local autoX region can't find two parking lot to race, the handwriting is on the wall in the bathroom, something else to get flushed.

Unfortunately as we grow older we slow down, what used to take a week is now a month. Finding the time to do things is not as easy when you retire, grand-kid sitting, making doctor appointments, wife's ills and my own, there is less time in the week, and the weeks pass quickly. When I was younger working 60 hours a week got a lot done, never said no to making a few bucks. Since have learned to say, NO, don't do that anymore. Have been playing with cars for 50 years, it gets old quickly now. As a sideline have been servicing appliances for the past 30 years. That pocket cash helps defray toy car projects and trips to the grocery store. What is nice about that sideline is a long service call is 4 hours, not 4 weeks like a door seal project. Monte projects are fit between everything else's time requirement, and with the 5 or 6 family vehicles to look after don't take on any more cars, learned to say, NO.

When I retired three years ago the local garage that inspects my vehicles and serviced the van fleet at the newspaper I spent 26 years as building super/maint at kept bugging me to work part time for them. "Your pace of play is to fast and I'm saving the few brain cells I have left to get me through the golden years" was my response.

So nope, enough trouble getting my own stuff done, don't need to complicate that effort more.
Bob

#1061073 - 03/11/19 01:42 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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Akron OH
Bob, if I were younger and we were closer I'd come over to encourage you while holding your beer. There are so many things I can't (longer) do on my Monte, but what I do is ultimately done so much better, even if not done by the book. I found a long time ago I can't work for others because I spend too much time on things and undercharge. Cheaper to just to things for free. Hitting NMCOA this simmer. With the hole it leaves maybe I'll try Carlisle in 2020?
Best and keep writing!
Gordon

#1061074 - 03/11/19 02:08 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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mmc427ss Online content
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Gordon, you'd like the Chevrolet Nationals Carlisle event. Have made several of them in recent years, with the exception of Kevin a great bunch of people to hang with for the day, or weekend if you chose, and a little more to do than sitting in a parking lot all day. Yes, some years have been better than others but still the best Monte/GM car event probably in the nation.
Hoping to meet up with ya there in the future.
Bob

#1061075 - 03/11/19 02:22 AM Re: new weather stripping question? [Re: Rodney]  
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I will go after this year, if for no other reason than just to finally meet Kevin!!!!

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