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#882114 - 06/29/11 05:51 PM GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE?????
monte87LSsssssssss Offline
Member

Registered: 10/08/07
Posts: 459
Loc: Marlton ,NJ
So I found a deal on a LT1/T56 for my Monte and figured maybe id sell my current setup just for the more practical everyday driveability with the 6 speed manual and fuel injected LT1 instead of my carb'd 350/TH350 I have now. Just an idea I change my mind all the time so figured Id just keep an open mind. Thing is I have no idea what this original ZZZ GM crate motor is worth. Ive done alot of reading on this motor and talked to a few people about it and they said I could get alot for it but not really sure what I should post it up for if i decide to sell it. Its really clean, ran great before I pulled it, only got 40k mileage on it which was in a weekend street car. Now its sitting in my Monte bolted up to a TH350 trans with a 2300 stall converter witha shift kit...I was thinking of selling the motor/trans together or just the motor. This motor is extremely hard to find and its a little piece of history to some, if I decide to sell the motor what would be a fair price. Below is a little write up on the motor I found from I think it was hod rod magazine take a look.



GM's ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine
Over-the-counter factory replacement engines have been available for decades, but when GM Performance Parts released the 350 high-output crate engine--dubbed the ZZZ for its block-stamped manufacturing code--back in 1989, it was not immediately obvious how big an impact the move would have on the speed-parts business. Never before was a purpose-built high-performance engine available with a factory warranty, a move that all of a sudden gave hot rodders a third alternative to freshening a stocker with a few bolt-ons or going the full-blown custom engine route. Originally released as PN 10134338 with aluminum cylinder heads similar to those used on the L98 Corvette engine, a Z28 high-rise dual-plane aluminum intake manifold, hypereutectic 9.8:1 pistons, forged crank and rods, and a single-pattern 235-degree hydraulic camshaft with 0.480-inch lift, the ZZZ was rated at 345 hp/370 torqe. Still available in revised form as the ZZ4, the original ZZZ led the factory charge into the aftermarket engine business and forced independent engine builders big and small to compete with lower-priced crate engines that carried more than a taillight warranty.--Matt King"

Other information says the engine used a part # 10134334 hydraulic roller cam 235*/235* @ 0.050" tappet lift, 0.480"/0.480" theoretical valve lift, ground on 114* lobe separation angle and pressed-pin flat-top hypereutectic pistons.
_________________________
1987 MonteCarlo LS---345HP/370torque GM ZZZ crate motor---Holley 670cfm Street avenger---Mallory HEI---TH350/shift kit/2300 stall converter---GN 8.5" rear 342 gears---2" drop spindles with 1" springs up front, Moroso drag springs in back---275/60r15 Mickey Thompson drag radials---reduced weight to about 3000 pounds even

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#882121 - 06/29/11 06:10 PM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: monte87LSsssssssss]
parts man Offline
10+ Year
Member

Registered: 02/19/02
Posts: 600
Loc: Maryland
I would say its worth $6-700.00 If you do want to sell it I would be a interested buyer. Problem is there are a million 350's for sale on CL, heck 3 weeks ago a malibu guy I hang with picked up a zz4 that was used in a t-bucket for all of 1,100 miles for $800.00

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#882190 - 06/30/11 12:07 AM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: parts man]
baaboo Offline
Member

Registered: 07/24/09
Posts: 8604
Loc: Racine, WI
Yeah, older 350s are all over since LS engines are the "new SBC".
_________________________
1987 Aerocoupe, 383 Super Ram and 20-gallon custom aluminum tank. Car retired (for now) from open road racing, but I'm not.

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#882239 - 06/30/11 12:02 PM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: baaboo]
monte87LSsssssssss Offline
Member

Registered: 10/08/07
Posts: 459
Loc: Marlton ,NJ
a ZZ4 with 1100 miles for $800?...i dunno about that Ive been on craigslist pretty much everyday for the past 5 years and deals like that just dont really happen. Ive seen lots of old high mileage stocker 160hp 350's going for cheap also seen a few GM 240hp truck crate motors go for about $700 but picking up a GM high performance aluminum head 345hp/370torqe ZZ crate motor with low mileage for $600 just sounds really silly too. Im sure you would be interested in my motor for $600 lol...thanks for the offer
_________________________
1987 MonteCarlo LS---345HP/370torque GM ZZZ crate motor---Holley 670cfm Street avenger---Mallory HEI---TH350/shift kit/2300 stall converter---GN 8.5" rear 342 gears---2" drop spindles with 1" springs up front, Moroso drag springs in back---275/60r15 Mickey Thompson drag radials---reduced weight to about 3000 pounds even

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#882288 - 06/30/11 07:25 PM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: monte87LSsssssssss]
BuzzLOL Offline
Member

Registered: 05/02/06
Posts: 5485
Loc: Toledo, Ohio
.. The ZZZ/ZZ1 isn't really as desirable as the ZZ3 and ZZ4, because the 235/235 cam (wanting to make 450 - 475 HP) was too big for the heads (about 385 HP max) and GM replaced it with the smaller 208/221 duration, higher lift modern cam in ZZ3 and ZZ4 after Hot Rod magazine showed them it would have a much better idle, much better MPG, a much fatter torque curve, and even more HP with a smaller, better matched cam... ZZ4 also added 10 more HP with flat top pistons...

.. It will be viewed as a used engine... but with it's performance and aluminum heads, may bring $1,000 - $1,500...

.. It used to sell for about $2595 new, but GM may have doubled that after the bankruptcy...
_________________________
'86 Monte LS (total'd Fall '2013), '87 GTA TransAm TPI350 TH700-R4, '85 Fiero 5-speed, '75 MG Midget Buick Alum.V8 BW 5-speed manual, '77 Pontiac Astre Formula wagon 5-speed posi, '78 F150 4WD 351"M ==> 400" C6, '79 Caddy Seville Olds EFI 350" TH400, 19' Slickcraft 425HP 351W MerCruiser I/O

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#882402 - 07/01/11 10:17 AM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: BuzzLOL]
parts man Offline
10+ Year
Member

Registered: 02/19/02
Posts: 600
Loc: Maryland
actually if you look there is a zz4 with 24,000 on CL right now for $1,200 with 750 carb and mallory dizzy.

crazedlist.org is your friend.

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#882407 - 07/01/11 11:36 AM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: parts man]
BuzzLOL Offline
Member

Registered: 05/02/06
Posts: 5485
Loc: Toledo, Ohio
.. Just don't send any money unless you're sure you're getting an engine and not an f-ing...
_________________________
'86 Monte LS (total'd Fall '2013), '87 GTA TransAm TPI350 TH700-R4, '85 Fiero 5-speed, '75 MG Midget Buick Alum.V8 BW 5-speed manual, '77 Pontiac Astre Formula wagon 5-speed posi, '78 F150 4WD 351"M ==> 400" C6, '79 Caddy Seville Olds EFI 350" TH400, 19' Slickcraft 425HP 351W MerCruiser I/O

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#882547 - 07/02/11 10:01 AM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: BuzzLOL]
parts man Offline
10+ Year
Member

Registered: 02/19/02
Posts: 600
Loc: Maryland
I passed on that and got a 330hp 350 GMPP crate Motor fully dressed carb,dissy,accessories/serp setup in black on the pallet still with receipts from jeggs this feburary. Guy gave up on a camaro project $2,000 SWEET ! brand spanking new and only 20 miles from my house. Plus after I paid for it the guy loaded it on his truck and followed me home with it. No longer interested in the ZZ

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#882667 - 07/03/11 12:27 AM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: BuzzLOL]
BuzzLOL Offline
Member

Registered: 05/02/06
Posts: 5485
Loc: Toledo, Ohio
Originally Posted By: BuzzLOL
.. ZZ3/ZZ4 used to sell for about $2595 new, but GM may have doubled that after the bankruptcy...


.. Saw it priced at $5700 new now... GM has gone nuts... can get better performance for much less elsewhere... pick up a rebuilt 350/383/400 shortblock and slap some great heads on it for less...
_________________________
'86 Monte LS (total'd Fall '2013), '87 GTA TransAm TPI350 TH700-R4, '85 Fiero 5-speed, '75 MG Midget Buick Alum.V8 BW 5-speed manual, '77 Pontiac Astre Formula wagon 5-speed posi, '78 F150 4WD 351"M ==> 400" C6, '79 Caddy Seville Olds EFI 350" TH400, 19' Slickcraft 425HP 351W MerCruiser I/O

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#882723 - 07/03/11 11:06 AM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: BuzzLOL]
Tony_SS Offline
10+ Year
Member

Registered: 07/24/03
Posts: 1840
Loc: Washington, MO
Originally Posted By: BuzzLOL
Originally Posted By: BuzzLOL
.. ZZ3/ZZ4 used to sell for about $2595 new, but GM may have doubled that after the bankruptcy...


.. Saw it priced at $5700 new now... GM has gone nuts... can get better performance for much less elsewhere... pick up a rebuilt 350/383/400 shortblock and slap some great heads on it for less...


Yeah, I bought my 350/330 for only $2300 new from Jegs. Now its $3400!

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#882741 - 07/03/11 12:58 PM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: Tony_SS]
monte87LSsssssssss Offline
Member

Registered: 10/08/07
Posts: 459
Loc: Marlton ,NJ
yeah I know the price of crate motors is through the roof right now I mean if you have that kind of money of coarse go for it but most of us dont have that kind of money to blow these days. Iv had this motor/trans up on craigslist with no price just enternatianing offers right now. I spoke to one person who sounds pretty serious he offered me $2000 for the motor and trans along with the 2300 stall converter, waterpump, and altenator. Im going to be patient and see if I get any better offers turns out this motor is a nice little piece of history to some so Im sure its worth more to the right person. Ive been doing alot of digging about this motor and turns out there pretty rare only 1200 made and the few I found who own the original ZZZ talk it up pretty good and get lots of replys on the subject. I know my best bet for a motor like this would be Ebay but if the right offer comes way way through craigslist within the next few days i'l take it. Or maybe i'l just change my mind and hang onto it wink lol
_________________________
1987 MonteCarlo LS---345HP/370torque GM ZZZ crate motor---Holley 670cfm Street avenger---Mallory HEI---TH350/shift kit/2300 stall converter---GN 8.5" rear 342 gears---2" drop spindles with 1" springs up front, Moroso drag springs in back---275/60r15 Mickey Thompson drag radials---reduced weight to about 3000 pounds even

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#882750 - 07/03/11 02:41 PM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: monte87LSsssssssss]
BuzzLOL Offline
Member

Registered: 05/02/06
Posts: 5485
Loc: Toledo, Ohio
.. Actually, whether or not one has the $5700 for a ZZ4, it's just NOT a good buy anymore, the -113 heads, although aluminum, aren't much improved from the 1950's design otherwise... sure, those heads make a great upgrade for a stock 305 if you can pick them up used for $100-$300, but not for what GM wants for the engine or heads new anymore...

http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/engine/hrdp_0906_small_block_chevy_build/index.html
_________________________
'86 Monte LS (total'd Fall '2013), '87 GTA TransAm TPI350 TH700-R4, '85 Fiero 5-speed, '75 MG Midget Buick Alum.V8 BW 5-speed manual, '77 Pontiac Astre Formula wagon 5-speed posi, '78 F150 4WD 351"M ==> 400" C6, '79 Caddy Seville Olds EFI 350" TH400, 19' Slickcraft 425HP 351W MerCruiser I/O

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#882985 - 07/05/11 08:27 AM Re: GM's original ZZZ 350 H.O. crate engine-VALUE????? [Re: monte87LSsssssssss]
BP One Offline
Member

Registered: 07/10/09
Posts: 168
Loc: Lyman, SC
A whole lot depends on what you have to spend in cash vs. what you have to spend in spare time. I paid just a tick under 4k for my ZZ4 a couple, three years ago through Summit. I could have gone to a junkyard, bought a used engine, rebuilt it etc, etc. I just donít have that amount of time to invest in an engine whose history is a big question mark.

Now that Iím no longer in my 20ís, My philosophy has changed a bit. I'm still in favor of a swinging deal, but I tend to have a bit more money to spend on a good, reliable base upon which to build. For me time is the resource I donít seem to have enough of anymore, with wife, house etc.

Value is in the eye of the beholder. I went to the Mountaineer Auto Show and Swap Meet this past Saturday. A guy there had a í76 Pontiac GP, supposedly garaged, never seen salt etc., wanting close to 17k for it. I sold my '76 Grand Prix (Golden Anniversary Edition w/T-tops) back in the Ď80ís for 1500 bucks. Would I pay what he was asking? Nope. Somebody elseÖ who knows?

Just a few thoughts
_________________________
Brian

My Homepage

1987 Monte Carlo SS
1987 Monte Carlo LS
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