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Kinda weird, you doing a little preseason maintenance and on this side of the mountains I'm doing a snowblower belt check.

Kinda curious why you had gear oil leaking on that side. Thought that bearing seal combo was the cat's meow.

" relocated the lower control arm mounts". That was done on the housing end?

When i saw Bernie last weekend he explained how he triangulated the frame location of the new 3rd link mount. I didn't crawl under his car to look. What are you thinking?

Tailpipes, he mentioned the trunk, I remembered you said Viking has mufflers and tailpipes in the trunk. We laughed but know there isn't a simple solution for tailpipes.

I watched most all the racing last night. Last three years I was in the infield to watch all of Sat night. But i must say i think it was Viking shocks that sponsor the live, free, podcast to virtually anyone. I had my daughter and son-in-law watching Justin's last run. Gotta figure out how to make the finally four cars all domestic. The KOTM event is huge for UMI, and they put way over the top effort into making it a GREAT EVENT.

Dyno day, a Friday, should be fun, should be educational. First time for me was a little overwhelming, because I did the tuning, they pressed start and stop and spit out numbers, that was it. Second time you go you know what is expected, not overwhelmed anymore, you have a game plan, for old school ICE. You'll have it much easier, a guy with clean fingers and a laptop will tune for you. Enjoy the day.

Bob

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Originally Posted by SSLance
I'm more interested in what the torque curve looks like than the actual peak number...and finding out what kind of timing it will take and still be safe. This guy has 5 hours booked just for my car, basically all afternoon. I'm certain he'll find way more out of it than it's making right now. Maybe I'll do a poll or something the day of...have people guess the peak #s. I'm betting most that haven't ridden in the car will be surprised though.

I never went after peak power either but rather looked for a nice linear curve with strong bottom end as all my cars and trucks are street driven, and drove to the track and back. We just did a 6.0 with 821 head swap on my sons winter Tahoe. We will dyno tune it in a couple weeks, I have it running very well but I know Mike can squeeze more from it verses me on HP tuners. I would anticipate around 500 HP / 450 foot pounds @ 6200 RPM from the similar builds I've done this year on two customer vehicles.

.



Last edited by 1 Slow SS; 08/29/22 02:24 AM.

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Originally Posted by SSLance


Yes, if you plan on doing any cornering, you need these bearings. You'll need new axles as the ID of the bearing is different, but they are VERY worth it...


The good is axles are cheap at 180 a set, these are no good anyways for the street, they're gun drilled.


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Originally Posted by mmc427ss


Dyno day, a Friday, should be fun, should be educational. First time for me was a little overwhelming, because I did the tuning, they pressed start and stop and spit out numbers, that was it. Second time you go you know what is expected, not overwhelmed anymore, you have a game plan, for old school ICE. You'll have it much easier, a guy with clean fingers and a laptop will tune for you. Enjoy the day.

Bob



As a skilled old school tuner of Carbs, ignition, I'm fairly good with HP I would say the Lap top tuners are more skilled IMO. I can much easily tune the old way and in much less time with less of an error factor, usually getting very little at a dyno. But that's just my experience. Buy the software and play around with a 15K engine and see what happens?? You might might second guess it being easy and see more gains than the old ICE?

Last edited by 1 Slow SS; 08/29/22 02:38 AM.

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I think all the heat we put into the cast center of the housing while welding the upper link in compromised the RTV seal between the center chunk and the housing causing the leak. Not sure if the axle seal leak was also caused by extra heat or just wear and tear. It was a small leak for sure, if I wasn't already pulling it all out to fix the big leak...I might not have messed with it for a while. I figured while it was all out though, why not?

Yes, we lowered the axle end LCA mount 1.5" to get my instant center way more better. I didn't realize at the time just how much it moved my driveshaft forward....enough to shove my rear output seal into an inney when it started as on outey. I thought about lengthening my Lower Control Arms to get the driveshaft back out of the trans but then decided an inch shorter wheelbase might be advantageous also...so chose the other route instead. Plus, it was much cheaper.

I think I'm pretty happy with the triangulation we did on my crossmember while doing the exhaust. It is amazing just how much stiffer the rear end feels when hard on the go pedal now. As long as things don't start moving around again it should be good to go.

I had a blast watching last night. So many of my friends did so well in the shootout. A few videos are sneaking out now, I'll share the ones I see here so you guys can see them.

I've had several of my cars on a chassis dyno at different times but this will be my first time having someone twisting the knobs and pushing the buttons trying to make more power and getting the engine optimized everywhere. From what I'm told I won't be too involved in the process. The tuner has a specific procedure he follows and is VERY good at getting the most out of an engine while also creating a safe tune at the same time. Most of what he tunes see race duty on a regular basis so he understands what I want out of it. Now that I can hear the engine so much better, I can tell where it's happy and where it is not. The hope is that he'll get it happy everywhere and maximize the efficiency to get the most possible out of the old truck engine. Andrew that has done the lion's share of my EFI tuning so far has been great, but there is only so much he can do from 4 States away. With this being a hub dyno, the tuner can load the dyno up and dial in the Acceleration Enrichment at different RPMs and loads as well as the WOT max RPM pulls. This is where I'm most excited to feel the results.


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From now on when people ask me what kind of racing I do, I'm just going to share this video with them.

https://youtu.be/pT8GSCrpPKw


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That Nova is serious, love that build.

I'm going to be in Tucson AZ in a few weeks, might be relocating? How's desert life compared to the mid west?

Last edited by 1 Slow SS; 08/29/22 10:45 PM.

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I LOVE the desert life... Especially if one enjoys doing things outside. The dry air is much easier on one's body, joints don't hurt, breathing is easier, and you don't sweat.

I'm not so sure about Tucson area though and we won't quite be out of the monsoon season by then so it won't be a true representation of our climate.


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The lack of humidity out there is huge. It's a lot easier to find/make shade to deal with the sun than to change your pants 3 times a day!

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Originally Posted by SickSpeedMonte
The lack of humidity out there is huge. It's a lot easier to find/make shade to deal with the sun than to change your pants 3 times a day!


'Xactly!!!

Not ever having to worry about shoveling snow or cutting grass again is also a huge plus...


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The grass and snow thing is a plus, but the population growth there scares me. Living in Rust Belt doesn't really have any advantage, people here are nuts too.

Back to UMI KOTM topic.
I regret not attending this year, was there for the first three as a spectator. But can say the live video coverage of the event was first class. I've been to dozens of live venues, Pro football. Penn State home games, Dover Nascar many times, PGA events, many others and what you find is the best place to get the most comprehensive coverage is sitting in the recliner. I get the sounds, smell, and all that live, in your face while attending but can say this year's podcast of KOTM
event i thoroughly enjoyed. A big thank you to UMI, and to Viking shocks who fronted the podcast.

We all know that racing old muscle cars around a "parking lot" is a relatively new sport, not really Mark, and several others had done it years ago but didn't have enough exposure to cause SCCA to create new classes for those cars Last event weekend at my local autox we had 19 cars in the CAM classes. My first couple autox 8 years ago there was no CAM classes, I ran SM.
And when i tell people i like racing around cones in a parking lot they still don't for the most part know why anyone would ever want to do that.

Lance, happy hunting on those factory race cars.
Bob

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So... Today's the day!! cool driving


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Sorry, posted in wrong thread

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How was the dyno tune session?


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A bit frustrating really...

We were late getting started as he was finishing up another car. He then started with base fuel map tuning and that seemed to go pretty well. He then made a couple partial WOT pulls and decided the AE tables needed work. An hour later and a bunch of black smoke he hit a wall and couldn't get the AE to his liking.

We discussed what was going on and I concurred to bag that and finish up the WOT tuning as it was 5 pm already. On the first WOT pull a glaring misfire showed...which got worse on the next 2 tries. So we bagged it and I went home.

Pretty certain we fouled a plug on the driver side during all the super rich AE tuning. I've since learned a bit more about the issues we're were hitting and think we have a plan to correct them, but I have to tune the car back up first.


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That stinks when things go that way, you'll get it.

I had to cancel my appointment two weeks ago due to TPS voltage fluctuation with no throttle applied. I swapped it out with a new TPS, the same result! Finally a week later found it to be a defective computer. Swapped computers new tune and a idle air control actuator and she is back to where it was the week before the bugs arose.


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Bummer!
But you'll be a lot more prepared for the next go around.
I would think the tune Andrew had in the car was pretty good and would think to drive it home you just throw that old tune back at it.
Being a car that uses an antique Qjet I had to go do some reading on the AE mapping you are dealing with.

Good reading for anyone with FI and programming.
https://www.diyautotune.com/support/tech/other/accel-enrichment/

Hopefully the next trip to the dyno will be the last and a usable tune is dialed in.
Bob

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At least it sounded good for a little while

https://youtu.be/MUh6MrnM__M


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I think the tune in it now is still better than anything I've had before, it felt great loading and unloading on and off the trailer... laugh

The misfire is only under a heavy load and it kind of comes and goes so I'm sure it's something in the ignition. Bummer is I'll probably have to race it like this Saturday as I won't have time to mess with it before then.

"If it makes sound that is"


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Good deal, hopefully it's only a minor fix and better than ever.

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Originally Posted by SSLance
I think the tune in it now is still better than anything I've had before, it felt great loading and unloading on and off the trailer... laugh

The misfire is only under a heavy load and it kind of comes and goes so I'm sure it's something in the ignition. Bummer is I'll probably have to race it like this Saturday as I won't have time to mess with it before then.

"If it makes sound that is"


What numbers did it make?


86 SS 6.2l LS3, Ilmor intake, Summit Stage 4 Cam, Stainless long tube headers, Stainless 3in exhaust, Tremec T-56 Magnum 6 speed, Eaton Truetrac 8.8 LSD, UMI Cornermax Front Suspension, 3-link Rear suspension w/ UMI Control Arms, UMI Front & Rear Braces, Brembo Brakes
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Originally Posted by Travis Jones

What numbers did it make?


We never really got a full healthy pull. You can see on this one here where it was looking pretty strong until about 5100 RPM where it started misfiring.

[Linked Image]

I'm pretty happy with the Torque number for sure though.


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Wow, that's real nice, nearly a 500 FT pound engine at the crank and nearly 450 HP is very impressive IMO. That's a bad truck engine for sure, making rock solid torque at a mere 1500 RPM. No dumping a clutch to make it move, you can bog it and load it hard without spinning, I bet it will pull like a freight train. That's why I always liked my Pontiacs builds, low end grunt.


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That was SAE also. Most people post STD ratings so the numbers will be higher for bragging rights. Plus, that thing has a lot more in it.

Based on how the curve looks up until it dropped off I’d say it was well on its way to 415- 420HP. Depending on where that tune was starting out maybe more.

Regardless it’ll be interesting to see how it does once they get the tune dialed in.

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The torque is a little peakier than I expected, not that there isn't a lot of it, there is! but it comes on in a wave at 3000 and then falls away pretty quick at 5000rpm. (but that also might just be the visual impression as the x axis is always a little squished with the Dynapack software or your ignition woes)

The the tuner definitely found some midrange for you. You even have my LS3 beat in torque production below 3000 by a few numbers.

The dynapack dyno results are consistent with the engine dyno results you posted years ago, accounting for the single plane intake/efi swap. What's interesting is that it doesn't seem to have moved peak torque up at all, but peak power moved up about 500 rpm this speaks to a better VE, usually you'd see that both numbers move higher in the RPM range with a single plane, but that also might be difference in ramp rate with the dynos, engine accessories etc. as also you usually see a chassis dyno show peak power and torque at a lower RPM than the engine dyno. My takeaway from this is I think the engine likes the bigger exhaust and headers. figure out the misfire and let this thing eat.

If you have room under the hood, I'd consider a 1 inch TB spacer, It might help take the dip out from 5000-6000, that's probably harmonics from the intake runner design, a little more plenum volume might help.


86 SS 6.2l LS3, Ilmor intake, Summit Stage 4 Cam, Stainless long tube headers, Stainless 3in exhaust, Tremec T-56 Magnum 6 speed, Eaton Truetrac 8.8 LSD, UMI Cornermax Front Suspension, 3-link Rear suspension w/ UMI Control Arms, UMI Front & Rear Braces, Brembo Brakes
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