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#1033528 - 12/24/15 10:03 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: somcamaross]  
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jmireles Offline
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El Paso, Tx
Originally Posted By: somcamaross


I need to get you hooked up with my brother in El Paso who has a 5.3/4l60 swapped 78 Cevy Luv. He says there arent many good gearheads in the area to hang out with.



That'd be great. There aren't a lot of guys doing LS swaps in their own garage, here in EP. Most of the swaps I've seen were done by one of 4 shops.


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1033892 - 01/03/16 05:23 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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The cam position sensor may not have been faulty after all. It turns out that the PSI wiring harness had a fault in it. There is a 25" harness extension for the Cam sensor. Somehow, the 12V wire and signal wire were in the wrong position!! I found out through some investigating of my own and help from PSI's tech support.
Once I switched the two wires on the connector, the P0343 code went away. I still need to have the Crankshaft position sensor variation relearn done to the PCM. It turns out of my neighbors is a GM tech. and has a tech II.

My wife and I took the Monte on a road trip which included the Grand Canyon. The car performed beautifully!! So with 3.70 gears, climbing in through mountainous terrain, driving at 80 MPH with an almost steady 30 MPH headwind, we managed to still get about 19.5 MPG. I am pleased.

I'll post some pics of our trip in the Lounge.


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1033928 - 01/04/16 12:09 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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upflying Offline
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Reno, NV
I thoroughly enjoyed your thread, I will be going through the same headache in the coming days, weeks, months and hopefully not, years.
Much of what you did and learned is exactly what I needed.
Perhaps one of the mods/PaulC can make this a sticky so it doesn't get lost.
I will be asking questions as the situation occurs.
I am currently at the gas tank phase, I am using a Spectra GM307C tank and a FG156a sender with a Walbro 255lph pump.
My LS3 and 4l65E should be arriving next week.
The sender is at a welder to have some -6AN bungs attached to the fuel lines.
So much more to do.
What kind of problems did you have on the drive to the Grand canyon?

Last edited by upflying; 01/04/16 12:18 AM.

86 MCSS Notchback coupe, LS3, 4L65E, QP 9", Eaton Truetrac, 4 wheel disc, column shift, Dakota Digital, silver with maroon bench interior

#1033940 - 01/04/16 03:12 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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El Paso, Tx
Thanks for the compliment, Upflying.

Mechanically, there were no issues but there were a few with the Dakota Digital electronic cable drive. Power to the ECD-100 would cut in and out. I'm not sure if the 12v wire was properly connected. In all, there are about 100 miles that aren't accounted for. After playing with the connection a bit, it worked flawlessly from the Grand Canyon back home.
I also had a problem with the fuel gauge...it still isn't reading correctly. An issue I haven't resolved yet.

Let me know if there is anything I can help you with.


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1034103 - 01/09/16 07:13 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Windsor, Ontario
what are your plans for ac lines....with the hooker conversion mounts i'll have to mount the compressor up high on the passenger side....i did the same thing and swapped over to the regal condenser too.

#1034124 - 01/10/16 03:31 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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jmireles  Offline
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El Paso, Tx
I'll probably take it to an A/C shop and see if they'll make some custom lines. That will have to wait at least 3 months, since my wallet took a beating just getting the thing driving! Lol


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1034173 - 01/11/16 09:21 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Windsor, Ontario
lol....i hear you on that.....i think my wallet is going to hurt now that the cold weather came, more time to shop for car parts.

my buddy has a set of 3rd gen f body lines, i heard they work, gonna try them out before he needs them back. i wanted to try to get a list of all the parts i needed for the ac, see what the cost is over something from vintage air, my guess they get close.

#1036290 - 03/13/16 07:20 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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El Paso, Tx
It's been a while since I updated this thread but I've had a bit of a roller coaster with this Monte. I had to drop the fuel tank to reseal where I used silicone....
MAP, if you read this, I should have listened to you. The silicone swelled up and worked its way out. I used non-hardening thread sealer on the connections and used a fuel resistant sealer for the tank. Well, upon dropping the tank I broke a wire going to the fuel pump and didn't notice it! After long hours of troubleshooting, I finally figured it out and repaired the fault.
Two weeks later the car stranded me as one of the fusible links blew!! Again, it was my own studpid fault for not taping the distributor wire and securing it better. It slid down the inner fender and grounded against the brake lines.

For the last two weeks, no problems or issues...thank goodness! I have been trying to drive the car "normally" to see what kind of gas mileage I can achieve but I can't seem to keep my foot from mashing the gas pedal...Lol This car is a blast to drive and highly encourage anyone contemplating an LS swap to do so.

I also must admit to spanking several riced out Hondas and Mustangs! wink


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1036304 - 03/14/16 03:52 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Posts: 106
Number1 Offline
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OK
Congrats on getting the car back up and running. I'm also doing an ls swap and wanted to know what wires did you use off the cars existing wiring to run for your ls swap? Thanks in advance and love the car it's awesome.

#1036305 - 03/14/16 04:34 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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jmireles  Offline
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El Paso, Tx
Thank you, Number1.

I used the same stock wiring going to the starter for power distribution and ignition. That was in addition to the wiring PSI provided for their computer. I believe if you look at the last couple of pages, you can see what I did. I bought my fan harness and relays from a member here (gmachinz).
Let me know if you how I can help you further.


Last edited by jmireles; 03/14/16 04:35 AM.

-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1037299 - 04/04/16 09:51 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Posts: 5,568
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Reno, NV
Unless I missed it, what did you use for a cold air intake and radiator cooling fans?


86 MCSS Notchback coupe, LS3, 4L65E, QP 9", Eaton Truetrac, 4 wheel disc, column shift, Dakota Digital, silver with maroon bench interior

#1037599 - 04/11/16 08:53 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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El Paso, Tx
Sorry, I just barely saw your question. I'm not sure where I posted that information but here's basically what I did:

Cooling fans:
'95 Camaro Z28 cooling fans (any LT1 cooling fans really). I was told they flow better than the LS fans do. I think I paid $25 at a yard. The harness and relays were purchased from Jabin.

Cold air intake:
I used the stock GTO air intake with a Spectra air filter. There were some pvc inserts I had to use to make the thing work correctly.


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1038042 - 04/20/16 02:58 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Posts: 106
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OK
http://s1200.photobucket.com/user/gm-muscle/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20151127_101322.jpg.html Does all Monte Carlos have this shift arm on the column? My car is an ss with floor shift.

#1038047 - 04/20/16 03:57 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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MC96 Offline
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St. Johns MI
Its for your gear indicator in the dash


86 SS
400SBC, 4l80e, MSD Atomic injection/trans controller, Tilt glass clip, all tubular arms, corvette brakes, 9" rear
In progress
#1038091 - 04/21/16 01:34 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Ok. So there would be no need for it since I'm running dakota guages and switching to 5.3 ls with 4l60.

#1038163 - 04/22/16 01:58 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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jmireles  Offline
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El Paso, Tx
I'd still use it so that you have use of your back up lights, safety neutral switch and functional gear indicator. Do you absolutely need it to make the car run? No.


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1038169 - 04/22/16 03:03 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Posts: 106
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Any suggestions on how I could adapt it to use it with my floor shifter?

#1038172 - 04/22/16 03:20 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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jmireles  Offline
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El Paso, Tx
You won't need to use it if you're not going to use headers. Headers gets in the way of the reverse lockout linkage.


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1042865 - 08/28/16 05:43 AM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Helsinki, Finland
this has been a really great and informative thread as I am doing pretty much similar project with my 84 elco. I am curious to know how much the front end raised with lighter engine?

#1042887 - 08/28/16 08:24 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Kane, PA
very detailed and useful thread,i will be doing this swap in my 88 soon.very nice work throughout


1988 SS bone stock,LS2 swap in research
#1067951 - 09/13/20 01:10 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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jmireles Offline
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El Paso, Tx
It has been quite sometime since I have updated this restoration thread...although there has been a few things that were quite important and worthy of documenting. So I'm having stalling issues that maybe someone here can help me out with.

A bit of a recap:
I have an '87 Monte SS with a LS2/4L65 out of a '06 GTO. The car has a PCM and wiring harness from PSI Conversions. I converted to a cable operated throttle body, so the PCM is from an '02 Silverado 2500. The power supply to the PCM comes from the starter and the ignition relay power comes from the old Monte ECM power supply, under the dash on the passenger side.
So around February, the car would stall occasionally when turning right. I would notice it a little more when braking and turning right. It led me to believe that perhaps the source of the stalling was caused by the ignition switch in the steering column. There is slop in the steering column. Normally, I would place the car in neutral and restart the car, I wouldn't even have to stop to do so. Then I began to notice the car took longer to restart. If I cycled the key once, I could hear the fuel pump pressurize and the MIL light would come on in the dash. Then one day it stalled when I was backing out of my driveway. I could not get the car to fire, it would just crank endlessly. The fuel pump would not pressurize and the MIL would not longer turn on.

I replaced the ignition switch but the car would still not fire. I next checked the power supply to the ignition relay and it check out...12 volts with the key on. The fuel pump relay is triggered by the PCM its power supply comes from the back of the alternator (Racetronix GN harness). It finally led to me removing the passenger front tire to give me better access to the wiring harness. I asked my wife to place the ignition on the run position and I wiggled the harness...the Fuel pump engaged and the MIL light turned on. I next fired up the engine. I checked the bolt at the starter to see if it was loose. I did give it a 1/4 turn, easily. Still, I feel it was not the source of my problems.
The car now will stall when idling in Park or Neutral. Another strange development is that after it stalls, the fuel pump and MIL won't work when I cycle the key and place it in the Run position. If I turn the key to crank the engine, the MIL will come on somewhere between Run and Start.The car fires up and runs...weird. I replaced the battery a month ago and I have checked the grounds (back of the head, battery to fender, battery to block, block to chassis, chassis to body).

I'm not sure what to do. If I were to go out now and place the key in the run position, the MIL and fuel pump will work but not after it stalls. I have no stored trouble codes and do not appear to have a vacuum leak. Can the PCM be bad? How do I check that out?

Sorry for the long post, I just want to give you guys as much info as possible. I posted this on LS1Tech.com as well.
Thanks,

Jose


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1067980 - 09/15/20 01:13 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
Joined: Mar 2000
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upflying Offline
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Reno, NV
That's where I would start, replace the PCM with another one. Sounds like the PCM is commanding the stalls.


86 MCSS Notchback coupe, LS3, 4L65E, QP 9", Eaton Truetrac, 4 wheel disc, column shift, Dakota Digital, silver with maroon bench interior

#1068044 - 09/19/20 04:44 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
Joined: Nov 2008
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jmireles Offline
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jmireles  Offline
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El Paso, Tx
Thanks Upflying, I may just have to replace it. A bit of an update:

During the week, I placed the key on the run position to power on the fuel pump but it would not. The MIL light wouldn't turn on either, so I left the key on and went to the wiring by the starter. I moved the wires some and just like that, the fuel pump engages. My problem may still be with the PCM but I am just going to have to crawl under, remove the starter, remove the wire loom and inspect each wire carefully. That is also what PSI Conversions suggested.


-'87 Monte SS LS 2/4L65e Quick Perf. 9" w/disk brakes
-'89 Iroc Z28 Stock 5.7 Edelb. TES headers, Borla Exhaust90K
-'77 Trans Am 468(Stroked) Doug's Headers Flowmaster catback
B & M shift Kit 400 Turbo trans. Edel brock Performer
RPM Intake Sean Murphy built Rochester Carb. Restored
in '08. 3K
#1068104 - Yesterday at 02:15 PM Re: 1987 MC SS LS2/4L60e swap [Re: jmireles]  
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Grand Prairie, Tx
I'm a little late, but I'd say it sounds like a broken/loose wire more than a PCM failure, although it could still be that. I'd see about running a new PCM power wire. Maybe just run a temporary wire to a known hot point (battery with a simple switch if you have it available?) and see if it all goes away. You might even go so far as to get a different power wire entirely, with a different pin, and plug it into the PCM to rule out the entire wire and not have a bad pin connection give you grief and lead you on the wrong path.
I'd try that before swapping out PCM's, unless you have a secondary one that you know works and won't give you VATS trouble etc. It sounds a lot like an issue I had with mine that ended up being a loose ground wire on the back of the head. Different wire, but similar symptoms of intermittent stall and hard to troubleshoot, especially when you talk about vehicle movement affecting it.


Shawn

'85 MC with budget 5.3L swap, TH350 with stock 2.14 rear end
It ain't much off the line, but it's nice on the highway
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