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#1058346 - 07/23/18 03:52 PM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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Hunter79764 Offline
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I imagine a capacitor on the wires feeding each fan might take care of it (wired in parallel). Might also help longevity of the fan motors, although probably not significant.


Sometimes you just need a bigger hammer...

'85 MC with budget 5.3L swap, TH350 with stock 2.14 rear end
It ain't much off the line, but it's nice on the highway
#1058358 - 07/24/18 03:34 AM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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mmc427ss Offline
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mmc427ss  Offline
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Pottstown, Pa
On autocoolguy site are these pdfs
First is probably the way they would suggest you fix the buzz via caps and shielded cable prior to the release of the Buzz Box.
http://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/8511ca_64f107c4d25b455ba44be33dc481d911.pdf

Next pdf is their Buzz Box install.
http://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/8511ca_a5b845522a4c4f869796f3f3ef1e2e7e.pdf

Would assume the Buzz Box is just some caps on a board inside the box. Wondering how waterproof that Box is?

Not that smart when it comes to the functioning of the caps, smoothing, decoupling, filtering, needed and how they would clean up the low frequency of the buzzing.

Will call them in the next couple days to pick their brains on a cure. Just hate to rip open the harness to get the fans grounds relocated to a Buzz Box. Already have done some looking at mounting and wiring the Box.
Bob

#1058360 - 07/24/18 01:44 PM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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Hunter79764 Offline
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Are you familiar with pneumatics or hydraulics? Even just water flow. Picture a stream running downhill, with a gate at the top that only has two positions, open and closed. To try to get an in-between amount of water flowing in the stream, you can open and close the gate really fast, and vary how much the gate is open vs closed in a timed minute. That is the concept of PWM for fans, rapid switching on and off. That water flow might smooth itself out right out of the gate, or it might cause quite a bit of turbulence as it is flowing down. That turbulence is noise, so if you can make a little pool somewhere in the stream, all of the turbulent water will hit the pool, settle down, and flow much smoother/quieter after that. A capacitor acts as that pool. The math to size it might be tricky, but for DC in this application, I don't think it can be too big (you would only get a little lag, hundredths of seconds, nothing major). Use the values in his diagram as a starting point, experimentation shouldn't be too bad since a capacitor that size is pretty cheap, you can probably find a kit with a hundred or more in different sizes for $10.

In air systems, it would be a receiver tank, or a water tower. Same concept, it just smooths out the flow.


Sometimes you just need a bigger hammer...

'85 MC with budget 5.3L swap, TH350 with stock 2.14 rear end
It ain't much off the line, but it's nice on the highway
#1058387 - 07/27/18 02:50 AM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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mmc427ss Offline
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mmc427ss  Offline
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Spoke to Darryl at Autodcoolguy today about the Buzz Box. Yep, just some large caps in his box. And he said the Box needed the chassis ground to be large, like a #6 for 50 amps. May have to buy the Box just to see what's in it.

At this point I'm not sure how much the buzzing will bother me. For the most part the fans are running at slow speed. On an 80 degree day today engine hot, idling, inlet temp at the rad was 175-178, outlet rad temp was 135, fans running slow, maybe 25%. When you turn the A/C on the fans will always run at full speed and cycle on off via a high pressure switch. With the additional load of the A/C, rad inlet/ outlet rad temps didn't change. On the 85 PWM there is a trim pot to adjust fan speed when the A/C is on. I have it set for max speed. Because I cheated his install wiring and use the A/C input to also run the fans via a switch, which is my "fail Safe" mode.
Drove the car about 20 miles today without A/C to see where the temp gauge needle would point, and how much deviation there was. Would say it remained very steady, not much fluctuation. Darryl's method of monitoring the coolant temp at the rad outlet may be the way to go. Time will tell as the seasons change.

The 85 will run the fans for one minute after you turn the IGN to off. Was thinking they would run at full speed but they don't, they run at low speed. The buzzing with the engine off for that one minute at low speed may be tolerable, it's not that loud.
When the engine is running making all it's music you can't hear the fans anyway.

So for now I'll pass on the Buzz Box, monitor the rad temps in relation to the temp gauge and see how well this new black box works.
Bob

#1058482 - 08/03/18 05:18 AM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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mmc427ss Offline
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Have had the car out several times the past week, all hot days, and the new controller is working seamlessly, doing everything expected and me not having to think about cooling system temps. The temp gauge only rises a little when I run the car hard through several gears which is normal. After driving the car hard, letting it idle for 30 seconds, an infrared gauge shows 178 at the rad inlet, 135 at the controller's temp sensor in the lower rad hose. The fans are running steady at a low speed, maybe 25%. Talking to Darryl he suggested allowing the outlet rad temp to go a little higher and have the fans running a OFF/ON cycle rather than continuous at low speed. Need to think that one through. I do know once the car gets moving and air passes through the grille the fans aren't needed anymore.
Having 10 years experience with the old SPAL controller and knowing what the temp gauge indicated with the Spal I'd say the 178 I see at the rad inlet now is 185 on the gauge. It's temp sensor is located in the left cyl head, stock location. I can live with that when it's 90+ these days.

Funny thing, cooling system capacity. I think a stock 305 system holds 16.6 qt, i couldn't get 15.6 back in after a complete draining, even blew out the heater core. Rad is a 4 core copper brass, Steward water pump, stock heater setup, stock rad hoses, AFR heads and a Dart Little M 4.125 bore. The block has additional flow around the cylinders, more cast iron, block weighs 202 lbs. My guess is the heads having larger ports reduces coolant in the heads, the large thick cyl bores of the block reduce coolant, the 4 core rad adds a little. Never gave it much thought to the cars coolant capacity before, just assumed it was more, not less.
Bob

#1059292 - 10/04/18 04:42 AM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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mmc427ss Offline
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Update, after about three months of running the Autocool 85 PWM controller it has performed flawlessly, does everything well. Whether on a cool day, 95 degree with the A/C cranking, or making hard passes on the car the coolant temp is very stable, about 185 with a 180 thermostat. I attribute that to the temp sensor for the controller located in the lower rad hose. Was skeptical about that when I was shopping the Auto cool, now think they have the right idea, monitor the coolant temp into the engine. I drive the car 12 months a year weather permitting, the 30 degree days are just around the corner. The previous Spal unit never had to run below about 60 degrees, I would expect the same from the new one.

As far as the fan buzzing it not an issue I need to deal with. With the engine noises at idle the buzz is not noticeable. When the engine is turned off the fans run for one minute, usually at slow speed , the buzz is barely noticeable, and only last for a short period. I can live with that. Adding the Buzz Box would require reworking the wire harness, not going to happen.
Bob

#1061893 - 05/13/19 08:52 AM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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Lobito Offline
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Lobito  Offline
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Time to give this thread a kick start.

Does anyone know the part number for the connector that goes here?
[Linked Image]

Last edited by Lobito; 05/13/19 09:17 AM.

[Linked Image]
#1061913 - 05/14/19 05:33 AM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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mmc427ss Offline
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Pottstown, Pa
Could be the fourth one down on this page.
https://www.whiteproducts.com/pull-to-seat.shtml
Bob

#1061977 - 05/21/19 07:59 PM Re: STICKY: Electric Fan FAQ [Re: lazygearhead]  
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Lobito Offline
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Lobito  Offline
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Thank you for the link. I think it might be as well.


[Linked Image]
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