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#1060066 - 11/27/18 05:45 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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thepezking639 Online headbang2
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Originally Posted by SSLance
Pretty happy with this...

http://www.azsolo.com/backup/index.php/events-info/results

And this...

https://youtu.be/V5F4cUXaNes

The data is not synced to the video, but it's close enough to see the Gs it held during the long left hander...


I am quite jealous of your ability to race all year...


86 SS 6.0L LQ4, TBSS GEN IV intake, 92mm TB, 30lb injectors, Summit Stage 3 NA Cam, Stainless long tube headers, Stainless 3in exhaust, Microsquirt ECU, Built 200-4R, B&M Megashifter, Torsen LSD, QA1 Lvl 3 Suspension Kit, UMI Front & Rear Braces. Check out my build thread: http://www.pro-touring.com/threads/126188-SSLOW6-0-Build
#1060127 - 12/02/18 02:55 AM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Check out that big beautiful new front sway bar!!

https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/SnBLd

Front is way up in that pic, must be putting the truck motor torque down hard...


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060128 - 12/02/18 02:57 AM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060129 - 12/02/18 03:43 AM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Looking at the pics of the "purpose built" cars you can't help but notice the size of the fat tires, especially in the back, 335s or maybe bigger, big advantage.
Does everyone run a 200 or higher tire, no slicks?

That guy with the orange helmet sure has a serious look on his face.
As always, car looks good.
Bob

#1060133 - 12/02/18 02:08 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Dude...its intense. Cant help but be serious when on course. laugh

200 tw tire is required, most of the fast guys have Kumhos though which no other series allows.


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060135 - 12/02/18 03:00 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Just funnin about the guy in the orange helmet. I know for the 60 seconds on course it's a different mindset, just trying to breathe normal is hard enough. My co driver always tell me two things, look ahead and BREATHE.

So the big boys at Goodguys are running a Kumho AGR, must be nice to have pockets that deep.
Bob

#1060138 - 12/02/18 06:27 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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So, I figured out the timeline... These three pictures were taken during my last run on Friday, when I was making a hero run to make the shootout. I overcooked the last turn before the finish, locked the brakes up, slid out and got two cones...it was a fantastic run up to that point.

Pic 1
https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/S55Ke

Pic 2
https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/S5Fs7

Pic 3
https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/S5AFw

Here's the video from same said run...

https://youtu.be/GfBS7PtgAJM



Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060140 - 12/02/18 09:33 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Looks like fun
Someday I hope
Keith

#1060160 - 12/05/18 08:28 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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MAP Offline
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Hi Lance!

Do you have any data on the torsional stiffness of that front bar relative to, say, the common 36mm hollow F-body bar? Can the torsion bar in your bar be swapped-out for different diameters to fine-tune that stiffness? I assume the torsion bar couples to the side swing arms through a splined fitment? That front bar is hanging quite low - no danger of snagging rigid objects in everyday driving?

(I'm entering the conversation late so apologies if I'm asking redundant questions.)

Thanks,
Mark

PS: One of the great things about the southern half of AZ is year-round racing weather, although it does get uncomfortably toasty in the summer, pezking. I live in the SW corner of the state, where we never even think of all-season tires for any vehicle.

#1060162 - 12/05/18 09:41 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Hey Mark...

I'm not sure of the Torsional Stiffness of the 36mm F body bar, but I "think" the last Ridetech MuscleBar I had on the car was around 500lbs/in in it's configuration.

I ran a 162# rear spring when I had my 36mm F Body bar on the car and a 250# rear spring with the last Ridetech MuscleBar and both were balanced pretty neutral. So maybe the F body bar is in the 350-400# range?

This new bar in it's configuration is 1181# in the long hole and 1485# in the short hole (where I've been running it last 2 events).

I can get other splined end bars for the setup to change the rate anywhere from 415# up to 1749# without changing anything else.

So far the bar hasn't hit anything, it's about 3/4" lower than the front cross member at it's current ride height. The swing arm end links hang much lower but they are directly inside of the front tires so speed bumps and such aren't an issue with them either.

So far, under normal street driving scenarios...you'd never know it had that big ol bar up front. It only comes into play when you push the car very hard.


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060171 - 12/10/18 12:29 AM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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What a fun course today!! Really got to stretch our legs today!!

Here was my 44.520 on my last timed run https://youtu.be/LnDOpeAhggcon

And here was my 44.289 on my last TO run. https://youtu.be/nUoaiUSyNbI

Results here...

http://realtime.azsolo.com/


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060172 - 12/10/18 02:21 AM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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That car takes a licking and keeps on a tickin.


Be a car builder, not a googler!
#1060174 - 12/10/18 03:14 AM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Sometimes I just shake my head at the abuse it takes and keeps coming back for more... At the end of my first run in time onlys...power steering pump was growling like crazy as I pulled back into grid spot... Shut it off, looked under the hood and all looked good. Started it back up and went out for two more hard runs with nary an issue...then drove home like a normal lazy Sunday drive. laugh No idea what it was, but it fixed itself.


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060175 - 12/10/18 05:17 AM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Close to or over 1G side load on this car at this point...

[Linked Image]

For those of you that know the struggles I've had with this car keeping that inside rear down...you have got to know just how happy I am with it now.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]




Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060176 - 12/10/18 06:31 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Best run with data overlay...

https://youtu.be/HFp8eajyVdk

The pics above were taken in the showcase turn about mid run, the right hander...


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060177 - Yesterday at 01:59 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060178 - Yesterday at 04:04 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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The results say you are getting much closer to the goal. Putting the car into the really fast group of cars is a big accomplishment.

Aside from the huge front bar what changed to get the rear end to stay planted? Car looks good, the camber through the corner is sweet, big change from stock and even the tall ball joint setup. Good pics. Videos run out before the end of the runs. That course setup really had the engine spinning on the long stretches. Here the courses are always very tight, setup for the little cars, not a lot of worry about over revving in 2nd gear.

Had the car out yesterday to charge the battery. About 25 degrees the night before, ran into a few places that they salted ice patches. Ran through them at 2 mph but still had to go back to the shop and wash the wells and car. Sucks to live in the East. Read this as envious to someone living in the SW.
Bob

#1060182 - Yesterday at 05:26 PM Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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The big bar was the huge change...the R-Joints in the housing were just icing on the cake I think. I love how this thing stays planted in the big sweepers now, there is probably even more in it as I learn to push the car even harder. I saw 1.1-1.2Gs steady and even blipped on 1.3 Gs a couple of times, that is pretty impressive for a 33 year old 3500# car with 57% on the nose and small 275 tires square. Not going to lie, I'm pretty happy with that. Plus, it's a hoot to drive now.

That course was fun, like a mini road course for sure. I knew it was suited well for the car after my first run, the mini coopers were in third gear for over half the course...and struggling. Definitely a horsepower course. The videos all go thru the finish...for me anyway. The long rows of cones on both sides were the shut down areas. And yes, it was pinging the rev limiter coming across the line...about 71 mph and 6,000 RPM near as I can tell. That is FAST!!!

Regarding weather Bob, look at it this way...at least you didn't get 2' of snow like my friends in Virginia did with this system. laugh


Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
#1060190 - 9 hours ago Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: SSLance]  
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That's one of the key factors i believe for an autox car, matching the gear ratio to the course. If you have the need to shift gears you're probably wasting time. Gearing to keep the engine in it's usable range without shifting gets you around quicker.

Installed 4.11s a few years ago to get the engine rpm up going thru the traps while drag racing which helped the ET. Last year ran an autox in the Hershey Park lot and found there were a few straight that I needed to shift to 3rd gear, just to many rpm for 2nd. Then you had to concentrate even more into the next corner, shift, brake and turn in all at the same time. Yep you get the hang of it but just makes getting around the course a little more difficult. Oh, by the way that was a wet course too.

One video ended right at the finish line.

So in the back no bar at this time, just the huge bar up front added, shock revalving, and a not worn out set of tires. Where do you think you are falling in the roll angle range these days, under 3 degrees now?

The rear susp in my car still not happy with it, the area to improve this Winter. More than happy with the front end with the 9 1/2/ -1.25/ 3/16" toe out remake done last winter. When I see your car's tires in the corner I believe I'm not far off of that, camber gain is sweet. I still thank you and Ron for imparting that knowledge. Just need to work on a little more Ackermann.

As far as the huge front bar game goes some thoughts. Here out East, particularly PA, the roads are crap. One of the problems with the huge bar up front is washboard roads, most every heavily traveled red light intersections is washboard. The larger the bar the more one wheel will react as the other does to a bump in the road when going straight. This will cause loss of braking under hard braking on a washboard. Through the years the stock 34mm bar was replaced by a slightly stiffer 1 1/8" solid bar, which was replaced by the F-body 36mm bar that has a pretty high rate. It's good on washboard but you need to be careful. Not wanting to lose the street handling manners I'm hesitate about increasing the rate of the front bar. Being able to drive 1500-2000 miles tooling around the countryside is still primary use for the 86. A huge bar up front would help tame the rear susp, just not sure i want to go that route.

Replacing the rear's UCA joint i have now, Delrin, with the R-joint wouldn't benefit me but I like the looks of it's construction and may throw a set in over the winter just for S&G. Still have the tool I made to do the job. Had 1LE rubber there for years before installing the HRProduct joint 8 years ago.
Bob

#1060193 - 32 minutes ago Re: SSLance's Build thread [Re: mmc427ss]  
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thepezking639 Online headbang2
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Originally Posted by mmc427ss
That's one of the key factors i believe for an autox car, matching the gear ratio to the course. If you have the need to shift gears you're probably wasting time. Gearing to keep the engine in it's usable range without shifting gets you around quicker.

Installed 4.11s a few years ago to get the engine rpm up going thru the traps while drag racing which helped the ET. Last year ran an autox in the Hershey Park lot and found there were a few straight that I needed to shift to 3rd gear, just to many rpm for 2nd. Then you had to concentrate even more into the next corner, shift, brake and turn in all at the same time. Yep you get the hang of it but just makes getting around the course a little more difficult. Oh, by the way that was a wet course too.

One video ended right at the finish line.

So in the back no bar at this time, just the huge bar up front added, shock revalving, and a not worn out set of tires. Where do you think you are falling in the roll angle range these days, under 3 degrees now?

The rear susp in my car still not happy with it, the area to improve this Winter. More than happy with the front end with the 9 1/2/ -1.25/ 3/16" toe out remake done last winter. When I see your car's tires in the corner I believe I'm not far off of that, camber gain is sweet. I still thank you and Ron for imparting that knowledge. Just need to work on a little more Ackermann.

As far as the huge front bar game goes some thoughts. Here out East, particularly PA, the roads are crap. One of the problems with the huge bar up front is washboard roads, most every heavily traveled red light intersections is washboard. The larger the bar the more one wheel will react as the other does to a bump in the road when going straight. This will cause loss of braking under hard braking on a washboard. Through the years the stock 34mm bar was replaced by a slightly stiffer 1 1/8" solid bar, which was replaced by the F-body 36mm bar that has a pretty high rate. It's good on washboard but you need to be careful. Not wanting to lose the street handling manners I'm hesitate about increasing the rate of the front bar. Being able to drive 1500-2000 miles tooling around the countryside is still primary use for the 86. A huge bar up front would help tame the rear susp, just not sure i want to go that route.

Replacing the rear's UCA joint i have now, Delrin, with the R-joint wouldn't benefit me but I like the looks of it's construction and may throw a set in over the winter just for S&G. Still have the tool I made to do the job. Had 1LE rubber there for years before installing the HRProduct joint 8 years ago.
Bob



Same here with the crap roads. I think Michigan has PA beat when it comes to terrible roads. I think the other way to skin the cat about not lifting the tire is to go to a three link in the back. I've done the math (or rather my fabricator has) and I think an S197 mustang rear end will work perfectly once you narrow it and weld on G-body lower control arm mounts.

We'll find out this spring.


86 SS 6.0L LQ4, TBSS GEN IV intake, 92mm TB, 30lb injectors, Summit Stage 3 NA Cam, Stainless long tube headers, Stainless 3in exhaust, Microsquirt ECU, Built 200-4R, B&M Megashifter, Torsen LSD, QA1 Lvl 3 Suspension Kit, UMI Front & Rear Braces. Check out my build thread: http://www.pro-touring.com/threads/126188-SSLOW6-0-Build
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