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#1066594 - 05/26/20 10:21 PM Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems  
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Fred SS Offline
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Glassboro, NJ
I bought a set of never installed Hooker 2050 emission legal headers from a fellow member a couple years ago. I had the headers jet hot coated and used Eastwood interior exhaust coating for the Y-pipe. I was running the Edelbrock TES, but I heard that the Hooker 2050's have better spark plug access. So I installed the hooker headers and was pleased at the improved spark plug access on the passenger side. The DS has good access also. My problem is with the Y-pipe. My motor is a GM Goodwrench 350 with Trick flow 175 cc emission legal aluminum heads. I bought these heads because they are advertised to have exhaust ports in the stock location, not raised. When I installed the Hooker Y-pipe, the exhaust outlets were about 1 inch spaced farther apart than the outlets of the Y-pipe. OK, must be something with the heads. So I split the Y-pipe under the oil pan and used a band clamp to connect the two sections. That problem solved.

When I finally got the Y-pipe bolted to the headers, I found that the Y-pipe hits the passenger side frame rail and the 4-bolt flange was way too high to connect the cat. This is with the EFE valve installed. I gutted the EFE valve years ago.

I can clearly see that the passenger side of the Y-pipe is higher than the drivers side. So I disconnected the two bolts holding the Y-pipe to the passenger side header and let it lower. It appears that I need a 1 inch spacer between the passenger side header and EFE valve to get this Y-pipe to line up with the CAT.

Has anyone had this problem with Hooker 2050's?

My plan is to cut the passenger pipe extension that routes to the header and install a piece to lengthen that section 1 inch.

Sorry for such a long post and stay safe fellow members.

Fred


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066643 - 05/31/20 12:47 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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I guess nobody wants a piece of this mess. I'm guessing that my problem was created by my aftermarket heads. I cut the section of Y-pipe that goes to the PS header and removed a small section. I will insert a flexible exhaust bellows that I bought off the internet that will increase the length of that section by 1 inch. I will try to post up pictures. Wish me luck.


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066647 - 05/31/20 02:34 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Good luck. My 2050s are on stock heads right now but I'm curious why it didnt work.. Must be something with the heads like you said. I was considering throwing a set if TFS super 23s 175s which I think that's what you said you have..


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#1066649 - 05/31/20 03:06 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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mmc427ss Offline
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Oh boy, been 15 years since I went through what you are, need to jog the memory.
With the old 305 ran the TES for several years, Randon Tech Cat and ATR stainless cat back system. A the very rigid exhaust system.. When the new engine went in with raised port AFR 210 heads, 2050 headers went on goal was not to modify the cat-back. First problem was the raised port, no way was the crossover going to line up. So first what I did was reused the EFE valve but gutted it and bored it out to the max, and added a 3/8" spacer at the EFE. This lowered the right side collector a little more and gave me good alignment at the 4 bolt cat flange.

The crossover pipe was a no fit from the get go. The 1/4" taller ports, a 7 qt stroker pan which required a 3/4 Qt notch in the front of the pan sump for the crossover pipe to pass, the huge Lakewood scattershield and one LCA mount all posed problems.
I bought a Hooker J bend 2 1/4"x 16" which was excellent pipe at the time. When the engine was installed I cut the crossover pipe ends off near the headers and fabbed and tack welded together a crossover pipe to fit the constraints, Took it to a friend and had the five sections TIGed. Just did a quick black heat paint and ran them for a few months, removed and dropped off at Jet Hot for black treatment.

I would say ignore the crossover and make the right side header/collector line up with your system first. Then see what it will take to modify the crossover to fit. Because you don't have raised ports, ?, it just may be a matter of making one cut in the crossover to tweak you pipe alignment.

When I did the TES 20 years ago the entire system was done to never have to do tailpipes or mufflers again, stainless. Later the TES were sold to an 84 SS, the 2050's replaced the TES and a testpipe replaced the cat soon after. Alignment of the cat to header collector was never really a problem.

The TES install was a little easier because the crossover had a slip joint in the middle to tweak the pipes.

If i can help you with some pic lets me know.
Bob

#1066666 - 06/01/20 04:13 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Tom, yes my heads are Trick Flow super 23 175. Good set of heads, but AFRs flow better. I would have bought AFRs, but TFS says their Super 23s have stock exhaust location.

mmc427ss, I had the Edelbrock TES headers on the car with the Trick Flow heads. The Y-pipe went on just fine, no issues. Alignment with CAT was good. I've been running that for a few years now. I decided to switch to the Hooker 2050s because I heard they have better spark plug access. I test fitted the modified Hooker Y-pipe and looks like a good fit. Tomorrow, I will take it to a shop to have them finish the welding. My welding abilities are not so good.

Last edited by Fred SS; 06/01/20 04:17 AM.

87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066710 - 06/06/20 02:02 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Below are pics of the modified Y-pipe. In my earlier post, I mentioned that I had to split the pipe under the oil pan because it was not wide long enough to reach both header outlets. The extension bellows on the passenger side, I bought off Ebay. There is a sleeve inside the bellows so it cannot bend too much, maybe 15 - 20 degrees max. I welded the bottom and I had an exhaust shop weld the top.. I know, not very good looking welds. I should have tried harder to find someone with a Tig outfit. But the exhaust shop only had mig and I did not want to go driving around everywhere. The large hex plug is where I plan to install a wide band o2 sensor. The photos were taken before I slapped some paint on it. The net effect of adding the bellows coupler was too increase the length of the passenger pipe by 1 inch.

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87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066711 - 06/06/20 06:25 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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I got the Y-pipe installed and it fits allot better. But the section that goes over to the drivers side is only about an 1/8" from the oil pan.

Is that too close? Am I going to cook the oil with the pipe that close?


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066712 - 06/06/20 12:46 PM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Originally Posted by Fred SS
.... the section that goes over to the drivers side is only about an 1/8" from the oil pan. Is that too close? Am I going to cook the oil with the pipe that close?


I had a similar issue with the 86 IROC I had running Hedman headers and crossover pipe that came on the car. If I had kept it, I was going to put long tubes and a true dual exhaust to get away from the crossover. It was probably just a little more than 1/8" from the oil pan. I could see when I was stopping at traffic lights the oil pressure would be around 25psi at idle. It would pretty much hold that stopping at traffic lights while riding around. However, if I stopped for more than just a minute or so I could see the oil pressure dropping and it wouldn't really pick back up - getting as low as 10psi after a 5-mile round trip and idling in the driveway.

So, I added two layers or header wrap (afterwards maybe a 1/16" gap) and that helped a good bit. It would still drop at extended idles but a lot slower and afterwards I never saw it get below 15psi.

Long story short, lol, the crossover that close isn't good and will definitely heat up the oil. However if you're at 1/8" with what looks like a pretty heavy wrapping of the header wrap, I'd think you should be OK to roll with it.

#1066717 - 06/06/20 08:25 PM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Thanks Kevin. I will put some header wrap around it for now and look to see if I can have a good shop possibly mod the section to lower it a little.


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066721 - 06/07/20 09:44 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Installed the CAT last night. The clearance with the oil pan increased to maybe 3/16 to 1/4 inch. I will still wrap it with some exhaust wrap, but the band clamp will get in my way. I did coat the interior of the Y-pipe with Eastwood's exhaust coating. It comes with a long tube with a nozzle that coats the inside of the pipe 360 degrees. After I check everything, I can finally start the Monte for the first time since winter storage.

Last edited by Fred SS; 06/07/20 09:59 AM.

87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066789 - 06/13/20 03:12 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Finally pulled the Monte out the garage. Only drove it down the street and back. Need to reset timing. I had pulled the distributor to remove a unnecessary emission pipe. I did not hear any exhaust leaks but I'm crossing my fingers. Need to get it on the road.


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066802 - 06/14/20 03:34 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Good deal - hope everything works out for you. Sounds like you have plenty of clearance at the oil pan now and with the added precautions should be fine.

#1066907 - 06/19/20 12:55 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Thanks Kevin. I took the Monte out a couple days ago for a short cruise. Did not hear any exhaust leaks. But at idle in park, I can hear a loud metallic vibration from the exhaust. I think it is the exhaust flex coupling I used on the passenger side of the Y-pipe. The coupling has a metal sleeve inside that is split in the middle. I think it is there to allow the exhaust to have a smoother flow without interfering with the corrugated surface of the bellows. I should have welded in a section of 2.25 inch exhaust pipe instead. Learn from your mistakes. I used the flex coupling to give me a little more flexibility. Since it is a bellows I thought I could give the ends of the interior sleeve more clearance by stretching it. So I used a crow bar and hydraulic jack to pry down on the passenger side of the Y-pipe, with the drivers side loosened. Thereby stretching the coupling beyond its elastic limit. Hopefully that will give me the needed clearance. If not I will have to remove the Y-pipe, cut off the coupling and weld in a section of pipe. Oh fun!


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066915 - 06/19/20 02:25 PM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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I just put my 2050's back on after a head swap, AFR 195's, maybe they changed something since Bob's experience but there were no issues with everything lining and bolting back up just fine.


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#1066919 - 06/20/20 01:41 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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The thing I do not understand is that I had Edelbrock TES headers on the car originally. No problem with the Y-pipe. Everything fit well. I removed the Edelbrocks and install Hooker 2050's and the Y-pipe don't fit, without changing anything else. Must be something with the Trick Flow heads.


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066920 - 06/20/20 03:44 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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If you remember the TES had a slip joint right in the middle of the crossover pipe, the 2050 don't. That made it a lot easier to align things. Sold my TES to a friend for his stock 84 SS, initially with the stock head and recently he upgraded to I believe the Trick Flow. He never mentioned a problem with fit of the TES either time.

The exhaust port height is always the problem when dealing with a crossover pipe. Those TES on my old 305 fit nicely, a Random Tech Cat and new ATR cat-back done at the same time as the TES which made install easier almost plug and play.

When the new engine was still on the stand a new set 2050 were bolts on, I knew immediately the crossover pipe was never going to fit. The AFR 210 head are a raised port. Even the original P/S pump bracket that bolts to a #1 header bolt was also lengthened a good bit (13 years ago).
The stroker pan necessary on the new engine went through some major surgery to be able to pass the crossover between it and the crossmember. I knew that from the engine stand and took a 2/3 qt notch out of the front of the pan.
Also the Lakewood scattershield is huge, move the crossover away from it for more clearance in case.

I looked the other night and on the right side I did make a 1/2" thick steel spacer which is right above the gutted and bored EFE valve. After the new engine was installed bought a Hooker 2 1/4" X 18" J-bend ( a really nice piece of steel), cut the crossover in 4 piece and tacked together a crossover pipe.,removed it and had it TIGed .
Burned the new 2050s in for 500 miles and then dropped them and the new 3" test pipe off at the Jet-Hot counter.

The quality of the steel in the 2050s is way better than the TES. The TES crossover pipe was trash at a year. Bought from Summit, shipped straight to Jet Hot, then shipped to me. I blame Jet Hot and myself for the coating failure. They may have been able to clean the steel better. I learned you burn headers in first to remove the oils. The black Jet Hot on the 2050s was 2008, still holding up very well.

Fred, You may dislike exhaust system work as much as me. My 72 Chevelle SS was our daily for 18 years way back then. Mufflers and tailpipes every 3 years for state inspection, laying in the grass along side the house, as the 4 year hands you the wrong wrench, The good old days.
Did learn a couple lessons from those rust in your eye installs, high quality stainless steel pipes and mufflers require only Scotchbrite every so often, and don't teach your children about tools, they don't buy their own and borrow forever.
Bob

#1066929 - 06/20/20 10:04 PM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Glassboro, NJ
Wow Bob, you did allot of work to fit your Y-pipe. But you are right, I do not like exhaust system work too much. Getting to old for that. I thought about having a steel spacer made to go between the header outlet and gutted EFE valve, but my fit check showed I needed at least a one inch increase in length on the passenger side.


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1066933 - 06/21/20 03:40 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred even cut the air tubes off the 2050 and relocated them to work with my cold air package. 15 years ago the emissions police needed to see all the original smog stuff visually. It's all installed yet.

Something us mechanical clutch linkage users also learned was the Z-bar and the O2 sensor location on the 2050 were competing for the same space. The heated O2 for the old CCC is now in the pass header collector. And in the common collector just ahead of the 4 bolt flange is another bung added for my wideband A/F meter.
A tab for the oil dipstick tube, a tab for the A/C bracket, and a couple spark plug wire brackets were added to the header flanges. All that was done when the engine was on the stand, much easier, but still a lot of detail to do. Better than leaning over the fenders.

On the original exhaust system there was a bracket from the rear cat bolts to the trans mount it i remember correctly. Is your bracket still being used to support the rear of the cat?
Bob

#1066939 - 06/22/20 01:42 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Bob, yes my bracket is still there to support the rear of the CAT. But I need to make a custom rubber hanger. I have the parts, ordered on Ebay. Just need to crawl under there, take some measurements, drill some holes and install the rubber hanger.

Just got back taking the Monte for a cruise. Looks like my operation with the crow bar and hydraulic jack stretched the flex coupling enough to eliminate the metallic noise. Didn't hear any exhaust leaks.


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.
#1067029 - 06/28/20 05:53 AM Re: Hooker 2050 Y-Pipe problems [Re: Fred SS]  
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Fred SS Offline
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Some additional info. The section of Y-pipe that goes under the oil pan to the drivers side had to be cut as you see in the pics above. After I got the Y-pipe fitted, there was a 1 inch gap between the cut ends under the oil pan. The band clamp seems to be doing a good job sealing that section. Have not noticed an exhaust leak. The band clamp is 3 inches wide.


87 SS, Harwood cowl induction hood, UMI trailing arms. Edelbrock TES Headers (Jet Hot Coated). Goodwrench 350, Ported TPI, Trick Flow 56cc alum heads, SLP runners, Comp Cams 260AH-12 cam, Trick Flow 1.5 roller rockers, Bilsteins, TCI 2400 stall converter, Ramcharger fans, Denny's 3.5" Driveshaft, GBodyParts GNX Wheels.

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